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[FAN] Leslie Goto Page: 1 2 [>] [»|]

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Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:28 pm


Leslie is my character who I want to focus on should I do the NaNoWriMo. I would like to talk about him here and maybe get some sort of storyline to feature, because... well, it'd be a heckuva lot more interesting with an actual storyline, wouldn't it?

So here's the basics:

-Leslie is a water nymph.
-Leslie is male.
-Leslie looks like a girl.
-Leslie is gay.
-Leslie is a barmaid, and his boss doesn't know he's a guy.
-Leslie likes skirts.

Now ask me questions and give me inspiration... please?

Because....... I got nothing.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:32 pm


Why does Leslie like skirts, and what is his family like to him?


welian

Captain

Eloquent Conversationalist


Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:39 pm


Water nymphs are androgynous, and for whatever reason, their traditional clothing is very feminine. They don't wear pants much within Leslie's tribe, traditionally, but other than that... it's just a personal quirk. He likes skirts like some people like chocolate. Or the color pink.

Family-wise... well, his whole tribe is like one giant family. They're nomadic, living mostly in the water, but staying in port cities for sporadic periods. There are some cities that they like to frequent more than others, and it is this city that Leslie has taken residence in. He found the constant moving tiring, because it was hard to make friends outside his tribe. Water nymphs don't seem to care so much when someone is homosexual, though it isn't necessarily accepted. It's more like they simply overlook that part, because they highly value tribe members regardless of... any quirks, for lack of a better term. It can be attributed to the fact that, for Leslie's tribe, the nomadic ways make it harder to lose someone who had previously been a (somewhat rare) constant. Plus some of that 'love is love is love' bit. Nymphs are very accepting of quirks. (Unlike, say... demons or goblins.)
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:51 pm


How is Leslie a gay guy when all water nymphs are androgynous?

Lyvidian



welian

Captain

Eloquent Conversationalist

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:53 pm


Lyvidian
How is Leslie a gay guy when all water nymphs are androgynous?

She has you there, Secret.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:59 pm


Well, the thing is that he doesn't only associate with water nymphs. He lives in a port city of humans, who are not androgynous*. This is my reasoning.

*I am using the term in 'having both masculine and feminine characteristics,' not being both male and female. So he is male, and water nymphs are either male or female, but they all look pretty much like they could be either guys or girls. But, due to their coloration and traditional clothing, they look more like girls. Juuuust in case you were confused.

Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler


Lyvidian

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:13 pm


Secret Kirari
Well, the thing is that he doesn't only associate with water nymphs. He lives in a port city of humans, who are not androgynous*. This is my reasoning.


This honestly doesn't answer my question at all.

Secret Kirari
I am using the term in 'having both masculine and feminine characteristics,' not being both male and female. So he is male, and water nymphs are either male or female, but they all look pretty much like they could be either guys or girls. But, due to their coloration and traditional clothing, they look more like girls. Juuuust in case you were confused.


You're twisting the meaning of a word to your own convenience. If water nymphs can be born a boy or girl, they're not androgynous. So from what I see now, they're mostly feminine water nymphs, and Leslie is part of that statistic.

edit: i dont mean to sound rude i if come off that way, i'm just pointing out the flaws i see
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:26 pm


Actually, according to the definition that I used (and, yes, I used a dictionary, not just my own brain), it is possible to be androgynous without being both male and female. A link for your convenience; check definition numbers two and four. Of course, I am human, so it's completely possible that I'm simply interpreting the definition wrong.

Thanks for pointing it out, though! I had actually not really known 'androgynous' could mean 'being both male and female' before now. I'd only seen it used as 'having both masculine and feminine characteristics.' I probably should rethink the descrition in that respect.

And for the answering of the question... well, mostly, I wasn't certain how to answer because I wasn't completely certain what you were asking. If you mean 'why is he gay?,' then, well... that's like asking why some people like chocolate. He simply prefers men to women. If you're still confused... please let me know. I'm still not sure how to respond.

Does that help? Should I try explaining more?

Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler


Lyvidian

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:35 pm


Using the definition "having both male and female parts" for androgynous contradicts Leslie being a gay guy, that was my point.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:39 pm


Methinks I spy a communication issue. Have "both male and female characteristics" implies that Leslie has both strictly male and strictly female 'assets'.

If Leslie is truly a guy, then he may SEEM androgynous, but really you'd be better off using "extremely effeminate".


welian

Captain

Eloquent Conversationalist


Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:50 pm


Yyyyyeah, I probably should just use that from now on. Or just say 'seems androgynous,' as Lizz suggested, or something along those lines. I already explained why I hadn't said it like so previously. I'd rather avoid communication issues... because they can sometimes end up badly.

I do see your point, though.

...So, outside of those sorts of contradictions, does anyone have anything for me to run around with like a maniac? Or are there more contradictions I've overlooked?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:57 pm


Well, what I think immediately that is always a serious red flag for me, and is highly unappreciated, is: "Oh look, another ridiculously effeminate, cross-dressing gay man. How very original of you."

At this point, since this is the portrayal I see from ... well, just about everyone online who isn't a gay male (and even then...), I'm beginning to think it's just fetishization and minimalizing. Marginalizing. Reeks of cisgender privilege, perhaps?

It's like people think anyone even slightly fey clearly has no other traits.

All Purpose Muling Device


Secret Kirari

Magical Dabbler

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:34 pm


I'm not trying to offend anyone, and I'm sorry if I've offended you. Leslie is, mostly, just a for-fun character for me, and is not to be considered to seriously. He's full of stereotypes and not supposed to be very original. (My more original characters are hiding in the background because they have plotlines.)

I really do apologize if this has unintentionally made you unhappy in any way, because that is one of the last things I'm aiming to do. I just made a character who's fun to use as a sort of... stereotype-mold-breaking. But not breaking a stereotype, just breaking a mold by being said stereotype.

It makes more sense in my head.

Although, on that last statement, if you ask me, there are plenty of fey who have traits in the exact opposite direction. Like demons (should) or goblins. Or dwarves. But certain creatures, like my version of nymphs, are sitting happily on the border between masculinity and femininity for reasons. My reasoning behind nymph appearance-androgynity is this: Nymphs represent certain elements (earth, water, plants, etc), and said elements, in essence, have no gender. Of course, certain elements lean more towards one gender than the other (water being more feminine and earth being more masculine).

Does this make more sense now? Is my poor excuse less offending?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:16 pm


Er, well, writing a stereotypical gay character and explaining it as "well, I'm not being very serious" is understandable in a sense, but it also doesn't remove the whole "this is potentially offensive to members of the LGBT community" since it still smacks of ... well, stereotyping. You know what I'm saying? I'm not trying to berate you or anything, it's just that when see enough of this, you start getting a little tired of it. Since I haven't read your story, I can't tell that you're using it well, so my view comes purely off this description.

And sorry about using "fey" in an unclear context -- I really should have thought harder about that, seeing as you were using a fantasy creature. Sorry. Fey is a slang term meaning "effeminate," when applied to gay males.

All Purpose Muling Device


Lyvidian

PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:03 pm


The only thing I find defensive is your comparison to the reason for someone being gay to the reason why people like chocolate. It doesn't make sense. People choose to like chocolate because the taste of it appeals to them. People don't choose to be gay/bi/lesbian, imo, they're born that way.
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Character Concepts

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